There Is No Mind — So Why Can’t You Stop Thinking?

If there is no mind, why does it feel so loud?

In this episode I look at what we call “the mind” as a living stream of thoughts appearing. Images, commentary, expectations about awakening, ideas about how this should feel and what should happen next.

We explore thinking by looking at it directly. Thoughts arise. They move. They dissolve. And it becomes clear that there is simply experience unfolding.

Some thoughts pass lightly. Others carry emotional charge. We look at how old hurt can still live in the system, and how protection forms around it. Over time, that protection shapes identity — “I am shy,” “I am not worthy,” “I am ashamed.”

Like a rubber band stretched between pain and the desire for relief, tension builds. When hurt receives attention and space, the energy settles. The story softens. Identity loosens.

Attention gently returns to direct experience — sensation, sound, color, breath. Life is already here before thought describes it.

This episode is an invitation to see thinking as part of the flow of experience, and to recognize what remains present through it all — simple awareness, here and now.

Music by Valdi Sabev, Visit his channel for more calm and relaxed music
 https://www.youtube.com/c/ValdiSabev/featured

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Transcript

You are listening to awakening now, a podcast for those on a path and in the process of awakening. My name is Ilona Ciunaite. I am a guide an author and co-creator of the liberation uneashed community. And if you are going through the process of awakening, this space is for you. Over the past 14 years, I have been guiding and supporting seekers in various stages before, during, and after the intense recognition of who you are. This is episode 122. If there is no mind, why can't you stop thinking? This is a recording of a monthly seeing through the selfillusion zoom meeting which you are welcome to join next time. And here we explore the mind as a living stream of thoughts and images. And we see the commentary expectations about awakening ideas of how they should feel and what should happen next. And we explore thinking by looking at it directly. Thoughts arise, they move, they dissolve, and it becomes clear that there is simply experience unfolding. And yes, some thoughts pass lightly. Others carry emotional charge. We'll look at how old hurt can still live in the system and how the protection forms around it. Over time, that protection becomes an identity. Like I'm shy, I'm not worthy, I'm ashamed. And like a rubber band stretched between pain and desire for relief, tension goes. But when the part that hurts receives attention and space, the energy settles, something softens, identity loosens, and the energy self-releases. Welcome to this. 

So what I want to speak today about is the mind.

It is the mind that is searching. It is the mind that is uncomfortable. It is the mind that wants some resolution and awakening and and yet there is no mind.

There is a stream of thoughts. One thought after another. Images, concepts, ideas, projections. and a lot of expectations.

It's like this this story is being created about how this awakening should be, how it should look, how it should feel, what comes next, how it fits other people's ideas. And that image is always being projected

over the actuality over what is actually happening here now. And it's so easy to get lost in the mind and the stream of thoughts cuz they are going non-stop. Thought thought thought more thoughts about more thoughts and thoughts all the way down. There's nothing else. Just thoughts all the way down. But this awakening is not happening through thinking.

It's actually seeing the thought process itself and recognizing that this is not what I am.

It seems like there is somebody in here thinking

doing something. Trying everything, getting somewhere. Let's go and get somewhere next or somewhere else or something else. This is not good enough. This is not it. Please. I don't know. What are you talking about this silence? What's good out of town? What does it do? It doesn't do anything. So, there must be something else.

So, let's go and find out something else. Even though the mind already knows the words, there's nothing to find. There's nothing to understand. I'm sure it heard that, but it doesn't like that. And I'm talking now about the mind as the mental energy. The mental energy is like a stream, like a water stream, like a river that something is moving, something is flowing constantly. And then we get lost in the rapids like watching the content. Oh my god, this is so interesting. Oh, this is so bad. This is so good. It's just so much like turbulence in these rapids. And the answer is not in that can get carried away all your life and never stop for one second and see oh what's going on here? What is actually going on here? Thought after thought after thought after thought.

And then there is an idea that you shouldn't be thinking. There shouldn't be thoughts arising and there shouldn't be um all this mental noise. And then we can go on a quest to get rid of it, to stop it, to reject it, deny it, and all kinds of tricks. Like if there are a thousand monkeys and now we have to silence them all and just to see what is there. But we don't need to silence all the monkeys. They can be playing.

So the quest is really not to silence the mind or to shut the thought stream down but to see it for what it is.

And you can notice I believe my thoughts. I don't believe my thoughts. It's just another thoughts. It's just more thought.

So what happens if we just shift attention gently into the body or into sensations? Feet on the ground, back leaning against the chair.

Don't need to think about that. You know, you feel

There is a room. There are colors. There are sounds. There are smells. Maybe

a taste.

None of that requires thinking.

I am now drinking quite a weird tea. Like unusual stuff. And I can't describe the taste. I can't say what's in it. But the taste,

it's what is being felt. It's not something it can be described. And that's just like a few seconds of experience. And we have a whole day going with this mind talking about this and that and the other and trying to describe. And then we get lost in the descriptions when something else is going on here. So much richer, more vivid, more intense.

So what is here besides thinking or what is here? If we don't imagine anything or what if we don't label anything? Yes, the labels are here. they can come but what's underneath them or besides them.

So it's not about stopping this stream of thoughts. It's about looking at the stream of thoughts as thoughts. Like it's so easy to look at color just like color. I can say oh there there are curtains in front of me. They are blue. That's words, that's thoughts, that's thinking, but they're seeing the color

without any reference.

So the invitation is just to dip below the thoughts, below the stream and see it. They keep coming. Don't need to do anything about them. Don't touch them. Don't touch them.

And it's so interesting when when there is this opening to see them, you can actually feel them arrive. See them as they come in.

And it becomes so clear that you're not doing that.

And that's not what you are or who you are or how you are. You just are. You're here. Colors are here. Thoughts are here. What's the difference? It's just a different flavor of the same experience.

Okay, now we can start looking a little bit deeper. Why there is this noise? Why there are so many thoughts?

We can see they are coming and some of them are practical, useful. Some of them are maybe entertaining and funny or bizarre. Some of them are painful, some of them are neutral. And these neutral or funny thoughts, we don't fight. We don't try to get rid of them. And we don't need a solution for them. But the thoughts that feel painful.

Oh, that's that's where the show kicks in. And you can see what the mind does. It will squirm. It will hide. It will reject. It will it will do all kinds of circus numbers

not to touch the pain.

So it seems, but that pain is here. The hurts are here. It doesn't matter if it happened 5 years ago or 25 years ago or 55 years ago,

it still hurts.

And the stories come in kind of like a a flag, red flag saying, "Oh, there's something there that hasn't resolved yet." And you may notice that life sometimes arranges situations so that the old hurt would come up again and again and again and we do all kinds of stuff to avoid that. But it's literally thought story is here because the of the heart because the heart is still calling. It's saying I'm here. Are you going to look at me? Are you going to give me awareness and time and space and just acknowledgement maybe that I'm here?

So the whole thought process of the painful thought process is like this. There is a hurt. The hurt wants to resolve. It's uncomfortable. The energy is tight. It wants to go ah release. But it cannot. So that hurt is being protected.

So it wouldn't be touched because it hurts. And from that there is tension of wanting the the wanting is tension. Wanting something else, wanting to be at peace, wanting to run away, wanting to get something else, wanting to be happy. But that wanting is the tension. It's like a rubber band. Like if you if you pull the rubber band, it's it's tension, right? On one side there is hurt. On another side is wanting. The more hurt, the more wanting, the more suffering there is.

So the stories or the noise is only saying there's something hurting.

And if that hurt is seen and felt, it selfrees, then that story is no longer an issue. It may come up, but it's neutral now. It loses a charge.

So we can look at the at the mind like a signaling function saying this hasn't been resolved, that hasn't been resolved, that hasn't been resolved. Protect, protect, protect, protect, protect.

And that protection hardens over time and becomes an identity. Oh, I'm always shy or I'm not worthy. I don't go and speak to people. Um I'm I'm guilty. I'm ashamed. That becomes that becomes an identity. We don't think that it's just an energy that hasn't completed its wave and left. We think this this is what I am. So it's a very peculiar process that is going on with these thought because you deeply know there is a hurt. The hurt is being protected because it hurts. It's uncomfortable. It's unwanted. So, it's being protected, put away so it doesn't hurt again.

But if you see that as your guide into what is still calling or what needs attention can actually use that

to find these places

and to give it attention that it needs so it can self-resolve. And through that this story is no longer loud. It may be soft whisper like yes that happened. Yes that was horrible. But it's no longer you know running at night when you wake up at 3:00 in the morning and you're not sleep and it's just oh that 50 years ago or 25 years ago somebody said this. No. How dare they?

And yet we haven't been given proper education what's going on with this mind.

And we have to go into that ourselves and figure it out.

We can listen to some people like listening to me now, but it's it's your own mind. It's your own job. And that stream of thoughts is is yours to look at.

And when there is enough space and enough awareness, when you start seeing gaps in between the thoughts, when you when you can look at the thought process itself, then it's so much easier to see through this self illusion of what is actually going on with that.

Like what is this eye that is being protected from hurt or what is this eye that is hurting or what is this eye that is having this experience and then you can start seeing that it's just another thought. This eye is just another thought.

It's not a person or entity. It's not who you are or what you are. You are here. That's it. You're here. Meaning here. Here right now. This is it. This can call it a web presence if you like or don't need to call it anything at all. You know you are here.

Can call it space. But I cannot say I am space. That I am is already a thought.

It's really good fun to look at all these energies and their patterns and how they work

rather than following the usual um content what they are saying which can be useful and practical and sometimes it's good to to listen to that and just like you know like you're listening to a radio to a television

But it's also good to see the process itself.

And this is where the fun is. It's like your own amusement park opens and there are so many rides and they are private and you can just jump in in any ride

and it leads to a lot of discovery and wonder and curiosity.

So yes, we have this mental energy. It's such a gift. Wow. We're not a plant can move. Can we can enjoy exploring our own experience

and then awaken deeper to what this is.

Not from something but to what this is.

The biggest the most common sentence that the seeker says is I get this intellectually but I don't see this in experience

and it is quite interesting because the experience is here the experience is is this.

not recognizing the experience

because of the mind of the thought image of how this experience should be. So the thought image is saying I get this intellectually that means I have an image how it should look like but it doesn't fit my experience

then what to do is is it experience that is wrong or is that the images useless?

What is here? If you don't have an image about how this should be right here, right now. And here you are.

during, you know, meetings like this or self inquiry trying to find the self like it it like the the experience right now is just so clear that there's no one here. Earlier you were talking about just labels and and um I think another word to describe what you were describing is emptiness, you know, like everything is just the way it is without, you know, tarnished by the labels I put on it. And and that's all very very clear. And at the same time, there's this underlying belief. It seems like it's always there that's telling me, but really you're a person that's in a room in a meeting right now. And I guess my question around that is is is there a certain amount of like does that ever stop? Are there techniques to get that to stop or or to really believe? It's not a technique at all. Just to be clear. Yeah. You're saying it is saying that you are the person that is in this room right now. So there is a voice or a thought stream that is talking to who? Who is it talking to? It's like there is you, right? And the voice is saying literally words. You are the person that is sitting in this room, right? But it's who's talking? It's even but it's even like preverbal. It's like it's like it's like when when the when those kind of thoughts show up, it those are easy enough to see through, but but it's it's like it there's a feeling that that

what's what's really there's I think someone said before, I don't know if it was last week, but this teeter totter of when I'm looking it's very clear that there's there's only this, there's only the five senses and whatever is happening. And then that very quickly turns into I'm g I have to keep on you know going on with my day-to-day responsibilities and and that feels very much like reality as me as a person that has kids and a job and responsibilities and problems and and that that seems to take up 99% of my time which I know even time and is is all is not here right now anyway and so so really you know like again the clarity is so clear. It's like even all my problems don't really matter cuz right now is just amazing. And at the same time,

there's this memory and anticipation of I know that I know

I don't know. I hear you completely. It seems very It seems very fleeting. [laughter] It is. Yes. Yeah. But you said it when you're looking it's clear. When you are not looking then where are you looking? You're looking in the thought stream. You're following the contained. Right. Yeah. And so I've tried to follow that back and there's you know it it seems like the underlying you just said like uh you know there's there's this tension and avoidance and hurting and it seems like that ties back to my belief in you know the in the responsibilities that I have and not letting people down. So,

and and I don't know if that like and that seems very real like yesterday when you know I had to go to work and my kids had to go to work and my car didn't start like that seemed very like my identity was very real and that that that like I had to fix that problem and and everything

you know everything was and there was suffering in that you know even know now I can see that that will all work itself out by itself and without there needing to be suffering without there needing to be a me that has to have that problem and solve that problem because the steps were very clear on what how how to you know where to go from there but I don't know how to remind how to remember to remind myself of that in the moment because it's so that tension is so overtakes me What if it's all included? Opening struggle. Opening struggle. Opening struggle. At some point, the struggle is no longer bad or wrong. It's like this is what's happening. This is how the moment is expressing itself now.

clarity and the pain comes in that wants to be seen. The story shows up that wants to be released. It's all okay.

The question is how do you deal with this situation? The car broke down. Are you going crazy like blaming I don't know everyone around golden universe or you like all right this is the next challenge what's what's what can be done

because if there is a reaction there is something to look at if it's calm normal thing just another challenge it's nothing crazy

there's nothing to look at yeah I guess I guess right I guess the reaction is that is is reality versus my expectations of what I want to happen which is pretty I mean I think right well the cars will keep breaking down people will keep getting ill heartbreaks will happen horrible situations will happen pets die everything is continuous it's just that relationship with that is either right oh poor me or whatever stories so that and again I don't I I don't I take I don't want to I take all the time. Um when you were saying that that what if it's all okay Yeah. with the struggle and the going back and forth like I I remember, you know, I watch a lot of videos. to read and listen to a lot of stuff around this topic and and I've heard that advice before and and I always think like if the message here is that it's okay to suffer like it seems like it's it's all for not it seems like like what's the point of all this if if it's okay to suffer and be identified like that that's I thought that's what what is the illusion that if seen through clear enough is is gone. But maybe does that never happen? I I don't know. It's a subtle thing because what are you calling suffering? What is suffering in your experience? What is that? How do you Yeah. So even when the cl Yeah. Yeah. When the clarity is there, then there is no suffering. And so that's why it so so so in the definition that that so my definition and the definition that I think a lot of teachers is is that suffering is identification with um with the identity the self you know the me and so that that causes suffering and I've and that that resonates in my experience like when I'm identified as a person that has problems there's a lot of suffering and when I see clearly that that's all an illusion And then there's no suffering. Okay. What is why? Let's keep digging. What does it what does it mean in your experience? Not what other teachers say. What do you mean? Yeah. By your experience like

what is identification in my experience? It's a belief that everything that everything is related to me and something that I have to deal with, right? Something I have to deal with. Yeah. Okay. Now, something I have to deal with, how does that look like?

Like in my example yesterday with with the car, you know, like like I am the one that has to get my kids to school, has to get to work, has to fix the car. like those are, you know, it's it's the to-do list. It's the responsibilities that that seems to be overwhelming and and and ties in. It's the identity that makes that a problem. It's it's me it's the fact that because all that stuff can happen can be resolved all by itself. I mean that's all very natural like you know life only comes at you one moment at a time and and but but that can it seems like that clarity only comes after like when all the struggle is kind of resolved and I'm back to normal and and then I can say like oh I didn't need to suffer so much during that experience you know but why can't I have that kind of clarity during that experience something is still unresolved It's not because of identification

as you see identification is some kind of concept but what it feels like in the body how what is your experience is pushing and pulling trying to carry life on your shoulders like you responsible that feeling of this heaviness of having to deal with this situation the resistance

Yes, situation is like this. There's tightening, protecting, guarding against something

even though later you can see that everything was okay but in the moment there's tightening and that feeling you can call resistance that what we call usually me that's what I am right I don't like it I have to deal it but literally it's the tightening that you feel where you have to push and pull make life happen. It doesn't go the way I want and the story starts running about me or I want this different this shouldn't be happening to me. That resistance the feeling is what we call me. But are you a feeling?

No.

So the resistance shows up only because there's something being protected.

Okay. So we can talk about identification theoretically but when you start looking what is actually going on in experience what is that right yeah that's good so so the whole yeah I see what you're saying so there's no identity there wasn't even yesterday when I was struggling because of my day there was no identity there anyway that was the story Right? You know, right? Cuz I said the the mind stream, the thought stream creates a story about me suffering. But when you look at what actually suffering is, is push and pull, trying, efing, not getting, not liking, all these kind of feeling of

right, which that's okay too. Yeah. Yeah. And that's happens. Yeah. It doesn't have to be called suffering. It is unpleasant. It is unwanted. And we can just acknowledge that this moment is like this. It's not pleasant. I don't like it. I agree. I agree. That's what is here. But I am here. And this is just passing through. This that is passing through cannot stick to now. It's just passing through.

So it's really really important to be clear about your definitions in a very precise way because we hear all these words we don't ever sit down and think of what that means in experience.

Yeah. And when you start looking so what was there there was just Yeah. There was there was frustration tightness. Yeah. Push and pull right. Yeah. Yeah.

Very nice. Yeah. Next time your car breaks down, you say, "Yay!" Cool. [laughter] Look at this circus. Right.

All right. Cool. Thank you. Okay, then. You Yeah.

Hey, uh, we have David or David. I don't know how to pronounce your name, please. I It's Italian. It's David, but you can call me David. No problem. David. I like that. David. Yeah. David. Yeah. Uh, hi. Yeah, I'm new here. So, hello everyone. And, uh, yeah, thank you, Elona. I only recently discovered you and your content, but it immediately resonated with me. And uh it you have a very clear and simple way to to to transmit this this message. And uh I just wanted to to to say that these are strange days for me because I think uh something happened a few days ago. I was having this uh video meeting with an awakened person that I contacted through the awakening collective website and we were having like some uh ping pong inquiry. She was asking me questions and asking me to to look and at some point she told some she told me something that uh really struck something and my mind stopped immediately. everything stopped and like uh tears began rolling down and it really like uh I don't know what what what I know exactly what it was but I don't know what happened but something really really moved inside and uh after the call ended like uh my body reacted the body reacted like it started shaking and I started laughing and It was like a big weight was taken away from from from from and something wasn't wasn't here anymore and like there was crying and laughing and shaking and heavy breathing. My breath started becoming heavier and heavier and uh it went on for several hours and there was also this big sense of grief like something wasn't there anymore. Something that used to be there wasn't wasn't there anymore. So this grief, this sadness and then I I I went to bed with these sensations. I fell asleep because it was very late. And the next morning I was still feeling some of this. I was still like in oh like I opened the window and the sun shone to to my face and I was like in front of the window in front of the sun rising and it was all I don't know how to describe it and then the the during the day but I felt so so light and I I could see very clearly that the the me was just a story that it was like just thought stuff coming coming and appearing uh one thought after another. Like you said at the beginning, there isn't really a mind. It's just thoughts that appear one after the other. And even the story, it's not really a story. These are thoughts that point to each other and reflect each other and they become strong because they reflect each other. There was a view. There was a way of viewing things before and now this view is like it dissolved is not there anymore and that is the only thing that may be changed but uh rest is the same. There is still the body that is conditioned. There is still reactions. There is still uh everything uh even suffering is still there because the mind uh pulls you in. The mind keeps pulling me in and trying to I mean there is nobody trying to do stuff there is stuff happening. So the the the the the thoughts that appear keeps being uh somewhat convincing because as I said before they reflect each other so they support each other so they have like this they are sticky they have this force and they pull attention. Yes. Here and there they move attention, right? And uh there's still that. So yes, I don't know. This is an opening. It's a beginning of this man. Before it was build, build build. Yeah. And now Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. undoing like a layering, you know. Now it's like a layering. You have your own amusement park. And now here is the next layer to eat. So resolve to clear. Then there is a deeper layer and a deeper layer and more expansion. It's just a beginning. So you don't need to worry about what's next. You just see what is here. What's next is already

Yeah. I'm trying like trying uh like feeling feeling feeling everything that it's here. Feeling uh trying to say yes to what is already here. So it doesn't even make sense to say no. But it's like uh staying here. Yeah. And uh yeah. Yeah. That's just that's uh what I'm I'm doing now. But uh so at this point it was just uh settling in the initial settling in and it can feel like euphoric. It can feel like honey. It can feel like most horrible right. It doesn't matter. But it's just settling in. settling in it. It's all good. Look at that. It's all okay. Yeah. It's It's strange because when I had that that shift, it was like euphoric on one side because there was this lightness and like the weight being taken away. But there there was also that that grief, that sadness, that like uh thought uh like things can't be the same again. So it's scary. No. Uh like you can't go back. You [laughter] can't go back. Like I'm sorry. No. No. No. There's no one to go back to, you know. Yeah. Yeah. And there's no one can that can go back. There's one going back too. And there's no one that can go back. So if you look at this like naked if you look at this very childish childish um example of Santa Claus, right? The kid believed in Santa Claus. It was magical. Look at that. What a what a interesting thing. And when they when the kid realizes that there never was Santa Claus, it was a neighbor or dad or some other man, you can't go back. Yeah. Yeah. To believing that maybe temporarily pretend, but you can't really go back. So don't worry, there is no way back. There's nobody replacing Santa. The magic is gone. The magic of believing is gone. M now it's reality.

But we believe in not just in Santa. We believe in so many things. Yeah. Yeah. [panting]

Yeah. And now it's the beginning. It's just the beginning of dismantling the whole amusement park. Yeah. the thing that that person said to me that apparently caused that reaction because I was telling her that all my life I felt like uh I was masking myself. I was like uh not showing the real me in order to be loved by other people. I've always been like very uh solit solitary kind of person and like keeping it for to myself and uh like trying to to give a a good impression to people in order to be loved by them and so trying to in a way masking myself putting on a mask and like she we were talking about like the 10 feathers and and and that kind of model and she made me realize that that is a kind of a ritual you know you you you do and so like it might be related to the third feather that you do that kind of masking that kind of uh things because you believe that by doing those things you will obtain other things. So I will mask myself because by doing that I will be rewarded with other people's love. And so that made me see that it it's like a play. It's like playing a character in order to to get something. It's so it's like a playing a character inside a character because there is the Mi character, the David the character that plays this other character for the world. And so it's like a double level of playing a character and that maybe I don't know maybe that my mind say this is too much [laughter] too much characters too much playing this is [ __ ] [laughter]

It's this is too much even for the mind. [laughter]

Too much playing a character a character inside a character. It's really ridiculous. [laughter] Maybe it was that. I don't know.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I don't know. [laughter] Okay. Okay. I will do as you advised me. Thank you. I'm reading your book uh at the moment. It's very it's very useful. Thank you. Thank you. The liberation book. Yeah. Okay. Okay. Thank you very much. Thank you, David. Yeah. Fun times. [laughter] [gasps] Bye. Thank you.

Okay.

Okay, Deborah, please.

Nice to finally meet you. Um, a question. Thank you. Yes. Um, I'm reading Lisa Cahal's book and I I've looked at the Liberation Unleashed website and I just have a question about expectations. So, what do we do with them? We just acknowledge them and then let them go through that we're aware of them and just be aware of them or when they're operating.

Wonderful question. What to do with the expectations? You you acknowledge them. And you you kind of know that no expectation is true. That's all it is. An expectation and picture in the mind how this should be.

There is one exercise that I like people to use at this stage of expectations is just taking a sheet of paper and writing everything down. What should and shouldn't be.

about anything and everything. And I'm not saying five things. Sometimes people write five things and that's it. 100 300 hidden expectations, things that come up once you fill the whole page like what awakening should be like, how I should feel like, what I shouldn't be like, what I want it to be, what I don't want to be. These are expectations. What I hope it will be, what I hope it will give me, what I hope it will fix. These expectations is just different word. Hope is the same expectation. So what to do with them? You write them down. You look at them and recognize this is what I want.

This is what I want.

may not be like that. Just to like let it go because we are putting hope in that. Yeah. Yeah. That's what to do with them is just recognize them because if they are unchecked, we can just um put them on the side for a little bit for looking purposes. Just okay, I don't know what this is. I don't know anything. Let's just look. But if we put them on the side, they tend to come back. So it's best just to deal with them like really recognizing that none of them are true. None of them are what this is. And are are they hindrances to Yes. seeing our self on a regular? Yes. That's there are literally two things that are in the way of seeing expectations and fear. expectations is everything I believe this should be because Adashanti said that Angela said that Elana said that or whoever said that that's how it should be it's not like they said there of my experience is wrong they are right my experience is wrong that's giving your how to say your power away to some dude or do this on the internet they don't know your experience you know your experience experience. So your experience is right, not the expectation. Expectation is never right because it's the mind thoughts about how they should be. But the answer is not in thought. The answer is in huh here this is anything missing. Is anything missing right now?

And you said you tapped on fear. So what do you do with that? Cuz there tends to be a lot of that here, right? Okay. So fear is a very interesting thing because it's the alarm. It it works like alarm. It says don't go there. You haven't been there before. You don't know what danger can be there. So it's just saying don't go there. You haven't been there. There may be danger and it feels like a horrible energy in the body, in the system. Stop. Don't go there. All right, then. Okay, fear. I'm not going there. There's a monster under the bed. Yeah, we're not going to look at it. The way to deal with the fear is to first make friends with it. meaning that you don't need to be afraid of it. It's just an alarm. It's not doing any harm. It's safe to feel it and it's here to protect. It's part of security system. So you make friends with it. Literally saying thank you for all you do. Thank you for protecting good old friend. Thank you for all the care and all the love. And when you make friends with the fear and you no longer need to be scared of the fear itself

can honor it and recognize that this is ancient mechanism in all humans and all animals in everywhere. It's the caution, fear, protection, self-preservation. So you don't need to fight it or get rid of it. Instead you watch where's the wisdom in that? Where's the intelligence now? What is being protected? What is that needs this protection

with it? Just leave it in the thought stream over there somewhere. Just look at them, see them, but don't engage. Correct. No, you look behind it. Once you make friends with fear,

not thinking but like really looking what is there that needs this protection and you look like behind the curtain you would look what's there.

So imagine the fear is like a door in a desert. There's open space, open field. There's nothing around. Nothing. There is a door there and it's standing there. You come to the door and you're like, I'm stuck now. Blocked. I can't I can't I can't go anywhere. It's walked. But you can look behind it. Can walk around it. But as long as you meet the fear and you run away from it or it says don't go there and you just run away, it doesn't stop. It keeps protecting something until you find out what that is. And maybe that something still needs protection. Maybe not. And that's the beauty of it is cuz when you when it's seen if the protection is helping or not, it can self adjust.

If it's not helping, it's no longer needed. It It drops away.

So, we can't run away from it.

No. No. That raising heartbeat's there no matter what. Can't ignore it either. No. No. Doesn't work. No. That's very, very helpful. Thank you. What's there? Yes. What needs it?

Yeah. Thank you. And in this journey, the fear comes up when the identity is challenged.

Oh, maybe that's why it's been so active lately. [laughter] Yes. Mhm. Oh yes, because that is begun in earnest. So that explains a lot.

Identity is here to stay as it is.

Interesting. Yeah. It's so interesting. It's fascinating. because it's very fascinating. Yeah. Wonderful. Thank you, Ala. Thank you. You're very welcome. I will take that to heart. And if you like, we can meet for a private session and I just guide you. Now, we just talked about it, but I can guide you through the process when you really look and see what's there and experience that. That's how your system learn. Yeah. really because we can talk about it, you can apply it but it's always better when somebody else guides you because of that mechanism of drawing back it's like you know don't go there yeah but I want to and then we get lost a little bit what's going on. So if somebody says okay just it's safe you can be here with that feeling with that sensation it is safe to feel and just hold your attention there for a little bit. Yeah, it works like magic. Wonderful. Yeah, I just made. Thank you, Alana. You're very welcome. Nice to meet you. You, too.

Hey, Doris, please come in.

Hi. Hey. Yeah. Long time no see. Nice to see you again. Thank you. Um I have something that gives me a lot of conflict and a lot of discomfort and it's recurring. Uh you know it's kind of one of those major themes and that is the hurt that has happened for throughout my life for different reasons. Sometimes I feel like if I could just talk to the person involved and tell them what I experienced and and that it's there's still this hurt and and [clears throat] I want to speak because I want I because there's this uh idea that speaking will um help it go away because it needs to be heard. heard. So I but I'm afraid to speak. I'm afraid to tell them because I'm afraid of their reaction. So every time one of these things comes up, I have to I go through all this anxiety and angst about um am I can I tell them? I'm trying to work up my courage and it can go on and on for a long time. to try uh and and then if I finally work up enough courage to tell them sometimes it does go badly and then and then I I'm left with the regret that I told them. So it's it's kind of similar to that maybe that push pull thing. It's like it's just pushing me to do something, pulling me to do something, and then and then um and then I don't know what to do. I then I think, well, maybe I shouldn't try and talk to them. Maybe I should just work on it, the feeling, the feeling of hurt and and not try to get rid of it by talking to them. There is a there is a shortcut. There is a way to deal with that and you don't necessarily need to speak to them. Yay. What you do is invite them for heartto-he heart conversation and speak from your heart to their heart by yourself or with somebody guiding you. And then that gives you a space to express honestly and truthfully what you feel. I listen to them heartto heart. I know it's only five minutes in our conversation but we can meet and I can show you. Yeah. Cuz you know when we speak mindto mind we are speaking through our conditioning through our expectations. But heart to heart is different. You can be completely honest and truthful to yourself what you're feeling. And just expressing that and recognizing that and allowing yourself to feel that open

and the the external result will reflect that because what is here the external is just mirroring his back. If here there is hurt it will show you that here there is hurt. If here there is peace, acceptance, forgiveness, allowing the external can do whatever it wants but it will reflect that. So it's literally just closing your eyes, inviting that person, saying come in for heart-to-he heart conversation and speaking to them and listening to them.

Yeah.

And that works. Okay. Thank you. And then after that, if you want, if you feel like you can speak to them, but it will come out from a different place. Instead of that compulsive place because I feel like it's a compulsion and I have to speak in these different instances. I feel I have to speak. I have to. It's very much like a compulsion. Yeah. But the part that wants to be heard, look at this. It wants to be heard by you.

The part that is hurt wants your attention.

We think we want theirs, but it's yours.

But actually when I do speak to them sometimes it re it really does the hurt really goes away whereas when I try to just feel it it doesn't. Oh no. When when you try to feel it it may be just feeding it feeding the hurt. Because if you if you're going to feel it in order for it to go away, it will not go away. If you're going to feel it just for the sake of feeling it, letting it be, acknowledging it, your awareness is what is needed for that energy to self- resolve.

It's subtle, you know, and it's easier to to learn by experience than by theory because we can talk about these things all day long and that will stay in the mental level unless it's experience.

It's same like you know you can read a book and say you know everything but you don't know anything because it's mental.

But all this noise, all these stories, all the hurts, they want your attention.

But this gentle kind, non-judgmental,

holding it.

Thank you. You're welcome, D. We can meet and I can show you. Okay. Thank you.

Um, just before I go, I just want to say that my website is being rebuilt and it's taking twice as long as I was told and it's still in progress and it's still being worked on. So I don't really know when it will be finished but as soon as it's finished I will have a space for my 8week seeing through the self illusion experience which is um which is going to be like a course of eight weeks which you can watch videos do your work do your exercises do your questioning inquiry and as well as we going to have monthly um sorry weekly weekly meetings for the questions and guidance and all of that. I just want to put this out. I don't know when it will happen, but it's it seems like it's getting closer. So, if you like to get information about that, make sure you subscribe to my newsletter because I will just send some information through that first. That's it. And thank you all so much for showing up today, for being for supporting people who spoke. Thank you so much. Yay. Lots of hearts. Yay.

And I will see you all next month. You will be on the 19th of March.